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Author Topic: Oblivion  (Read 34561 times)
NecrosIhsan
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« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2006, 06:45:39 PM »

ONE crash is too many for me...now I KNOW I wouldn't like the game.
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jsmith71
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« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2006, 06:47:27 PM »

The only time it's crashed for me is when I quit.
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KiZ
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« Reply #17 on: March 28, 2006, 07:53:22 PM »

Quote from: "Z!re"
What oblivion really is:
1) random crashes
2) random freezes
3) inability to run at an acceptable speed on most system
4) major bugs with the "red needle" on the compas
5) many players are forced to find third party, fan-made, patches to even make it work on their ancient systems, such as 3400+ 1GB RAM
6) no patches will ever be released, bethesda doesent make patches, ever
7) bethesda bans users that complain and point out major flaws in the game, from the official forum
8) the minimum system requirements were raised. AFTER the game was released and hundreds of thousands (some say millions) of pre-order copies were sold. effectively making half of those who ordered the game order it for no use (FX cards no longer supported, box state they are)


Answer to all those questions... you should have got an xbox 360

xD

No compatibility problems, its man enough to play it with the gfx on full, and doesnt freeze.

(ya ya, I know, its no excuse.. or whatever)

Well ok, the 360 is known to freeze on occasion. But thats only happened to me about 4 times the entire time Ive had it :)
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jsmith71
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« Reply #18 on: March 28, 2006, 07:56:39 PM »

Quote from: "KiZ"
Quote from: "Z!re"
What oblivion really is:
1) random crashes
2) random freezes
3) inability to run at an acceptable speed on most system
4) major bugs with the "red needle" on the compas
5) many players are forced to find third party, fan-made, patches to even make it work on their ancient systems, such as 3400+ 1GB RAM
6) no patches will ever be released, bethesda doesent make patches, ever
7) bethesda bans users that complain and point out major flaws in the game, from the official forum
Cool the minimum system requirements were raised. AFTER the game was released and hundreds of thousands (some say millions) of pre-order copies were sold. effectively making half of those who ordered the game order it for no use (FX cards no longer supported, box state they are)


Answer to all those questions... you should have got an xbox 360

xD

No compatibility problems, its man enough to play it with the gfx on full, and doesnt freeze.

No. Well, yes. But the reason for some of the flaws in the PC version (like the simply ABYSMAL draw distance on small foliage/weeds/grass) is because they were developing it for both PC and xbox 360 at the same time. You know, I'm really beginning to hate that damn console and its predecessor. Tongue Same problem with Thief 3 (which aside from these complaints was an excellent experience), the loading zones and other limitations (no water.........) was because they were developing it for PC and xbox. Pisses me off. They could do the PC version first and strip it down for the console, but no...
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KiZ
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« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2006, 08:08:14 PM »

Quote from: "Josiah Tobin"
No. Well, yes. But the reason for some of the flaws in the PC version (like the simply ABYSMAL draw distance on small foliage/weeds/grass) is because they were developing it for both PC and xbox 360 at the same time. You know, I'm really beginning to hate that damn console and its predecessor. :P Same problem with Thief 3 (which aside from these complaints was an excellent experience), the loading zones and other limitations (no water.........) was because they were developing it for PC and xbox. Pisses me off. They could do the PC version first and strip it down for the console, but no...


Yeah, I would admit some games have been crippled because of console development, but are you sure about that being the case for the 360?
It is faster than pretty much all of the current mainstream computers, has sufficient RAM and a blistering GPU as well. I dont see how developing for it could make a game worse for the PC (apart from lazy developers not porting good control styles to take advantage of keyboard/mouse etc)
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Z!re
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« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2006, 08:55:56 PM »

The 360 isnt faster, or better than modern computers.. games simply take advantage of a single system..
If you're only deving for one single system, you can make it look good, and run good on that system..

Oblivion just simply sucks ass when it comes to support for different hardware..

If you want proof, go visit the official oblivion forum, software and hardware section.. there's so much posting going on, that topics get to their 200 post limit before even going offpage (20 or so topics shown per page)

Half of them are people asking why the hell the game doesent work on their computer.


And as for the clever remark by Deleter, you dont freakin say!? really!? i knew i had missed something!
But as I've said many times before, if my computer can do Doom 3, Quake 4 and HL2 all at 40+ FPS, with near max or even ultra settings.. then oblivion shouldnt give me fucking 5 fps on a hacked lower than lowest setting (Disabled shaders, forced dx 7 mode, no textures, no lightning.. all crap basically.. barely playable)

In any case, i've returned my copy, even got my money back (Turns out i wasnt the only one returning it)
And I wont get it again until they make some proper patches for it.. and then i wont buy it.. screw bethesda.. worst developers ever..

Also, get oblivion for your fucking cellphone, today! (Not joking)


In conclusion, as Dave said, a single crash is too much. Games shouldnt crash anymore, thats a thing of the past.. If peoples FB games crash, what do we do? We complain until it's fixed.. No game is considered done until all crashes are gone.. so how come we accept idiots like bethesda release crashing unpatched shit?.. just curious...

Oblivion pisses me off....
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Agamemnus
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« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2006, 09:23:22 PM »

Well, you can't expect all companies to be a group of slaves and slave drivers... sure they make mistakes.. errare humanum est..  :normal:
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Deleter
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« Reply #22 on: March 28, 2006, 10:17:37 PM »

MAYBE its because fb game developers don't have publishers who force them to release their games before they are ready. MAYBE its because FB games are like 3 generations ago or older in terms of technology. MAYBE its because fb games are released to a very small audience compared to commercial games. MAYBE its because FB games are so far from pushing the technological envelope, that you could hardly screw up that bad to have an unfixible game. Or maybe its just because bethasda wants to make horrible games and not patch them and in general screw their customers. Yeah, thats definitely it... :roll:

Your argument - "OMG, IT DIDN'T WORK WAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHA IT SUXZ0RS, ITS DEVELOPERS SUXZ0RS"....honesty I wonder about you sometimes....no wait, I don't, I am too busy playing Oblivion, which is the best computer game I have played in ages.... Tongue
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jsmith71
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« Reply #23 on: March 28, 2006, 10:38:38 PM »

Quote from: "Deleter"
MAYBE its because fb game developers don't have publishers who force them to release their games before they are ready. MAYBE its because FB games are like 3 generations ago or older in terms of technology. MAYBE its because fb games are released to a very small audience compared to commercial games. MAYBE its because FB games are so far from pushing the technological envelope, that you could hardly screw up that bad to have an unfixible game. Or maybe its just because bethasda wants to make horrible games and not patch them and in general screw their customers. Yeah, thats definitely it... :roll:

Good points. Good fucking points. Tongue
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SJ Zero
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« Reply #24 on: March 28, 2006, 11:06:43 PM »

I hate to break the news to you, but MOST basic games are critically broken in one way or another.

Besides -- MOST basic games never get released, or are released as unfinished demos.

Trying to compare a commercial release from bethesda to basic development is so far through the looking glass that you're having tea with the queen of hearts.
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1000101
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« Reply #25 on: March 29, 2006, 12:16:48 AM »

hrm, other then my card should be able to do HDR but Oblivion won't let it, the game runs fine for me with Bloom and 6x AA with the settings cranked up the max.  I have the personal shadows turned off because they don't work right (hell, shadows in Morrowind were farked too).

Also, comparing the framerates of Morrowind/Oblivion to an FPS is utter stupidity.  An FPS only has two things to do:  Keep track of people, keep track of bullets.  Morrowind and Oblivion are doing a frig of a lot more per frame then HL2 does in the entire length of time it runs.  It's like saying Windows sucks compared to a single function embeded OS.  There is simply no comparison.

I'll grant you, Bethesda piss me off with the bugs, no optimization, no patches, no acknowledgements and they should test on more systems and debug further; but the game is fairly impressive and a few crashes is not going to stop me from playing it.  Further, the crashes give me a chance to get up and go pee as I've been holding it for an hour Cheesy  Hell, this post only came about because of a crash, heh.

Anyway, back to my 3rd level WitchHunter pwning everything.

ps:  Stealth + Marksmen = you're friend.
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Z!re
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« Reply #26 on: March 29, 2006, 04:16:36 AM »

I never said Oblivion wasnt impressive, or that the actuall game wasnt cool..

I said it behaved like shit, crashed constantly, and you couldnt run it for shit on my computer, which can handle the extra info no problem.. it's the gfx that kill it.. for some unknown reason..

I think many people missed that point.. And instead as the zealots they are went: ZOMG OBLIVION IS BESTEST I WANT TO MAKE LOVE TO IT!11

In any case, my referance to FB games is sound, take Lynns Legacy, cha0s was really tired when it stopped working (Remember the release that didnt work a few days ago?) Yet, instead of going: Fuck it, I'll just release it anyways.
He fixed the bug, and now most/all people can play Lynns Legacy..
(No, I'm not comparing complexity, so dont bother.. Neither am I saying LL is as advanced as Oblivion.. but still)

In my opinion, releasing a game that crashes, where it's a known problem. Is a bad fucking move.
Raising the minimum system requirements after the game has been released is just damn evil.

All boils down to bethesda actually hating players.. much like sony online..
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jsmith71
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« Reply #27 on: March 29, 2006, 05:06:48 AM »

Quote from: "Z!re"
In any case, my referance to FB games is sound, take Lynns Legacy, cha0s was really tired when it stopped working (Remember the release that didnt work a few days ago?) Yet, instead of going: @$ it, I'll just release it anyways.
He fixed the bug, and now most/all people can play Lynns Legacy..

I can't, and I'm the other half of the team. Cheesy I laugh at my computer.
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1000101
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« Reply #28 on: March 29, 2006, 03:17:33 PM »

Quote from: "Z!re"
In my opinion, releasing a game that crashes, where it's a known problem. Is a bad @$ move.
Raising the minimum system requirements after the game has been released is just damn evil.

All boils down to bethesda actually hating players.. much like sony online..


Yes, the known crashing and bugs should have been fixed before a full release.  I've asked people to test something which is buggy and told them, "it crashes under these conditions, I know about this, I'm working on this, but please test it to see where else it may crash."  But that is in pre-alpha closed releases.  That is what that stage is for.  It seems Bethesda only does an in-house alpha test then ships when the bugs/hour rate drops to 1 or lower.  "Everyone crashes at the same point except this one specific setup of computer?  Good enough!  SHIP!"

Raising the specs after release sounds like a market grab to me.  There is no way you'd know something like that and not know it months earlier.  "Shit.  Turns out we need a better system...we'll if we tell people, sales will drop."

As to hating players, I'm not sure if it's player hostility or simply apathy.

In any event it all boils down to Bethesda cranking out a product which is buggy, lieing to sell more copies then ignoring people who have legitimate problems.  Sounds like a small little Redmond company we all hate.
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Life is like a box of chocolates', hrm, WTF, no it isn't, more like, 'life is like a steaming pile of horse crap.'
Deleter
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« Reply #29 on: March 29, 2006, 08:51:56 PM »

Yes z!re, and I am sure there are commercial games that are stable as well, Oblivion is just not one of them. Ntm, you cited one example, that doesn't mean alot. And even if the general fb games array is more stable, you might want to sit back and think about it. Most FB games either copy game ideas (as far as engine, I'm not saying they are all clones) that are at least a decade old. The technology that goes into an fb game is so old that if it was not stable, it would just mean the laziest programmer ever. Oblivion pushes the envolope on numerous fronts. Graphics wise, Oblivion is the most immersive (minus the crappy lip synching) and best looking game. In my opinion, it looks better than HL2 or Doom 3, even if that is just because they know what the word variance means. The almost complete openness of the game is another thing fb game programmers simply dream of. The AI system is more advanced than most games today. The combat system is very fluid and manages to do something few if any games have achieved before it with such eloquence. Damn, its a wonder they even got it out the door at all, with all the things they crammed in there.

So why does it crash on some peoples systems? Because when it does work, it is a piece of art. You seem to forget the fact its the publishers or money constraints that push games out the door, not developers. No one spends five years on a game and then says "fuck it, I will just release this pos and give up on it", and if they do they won't be working on games much longer. Seeing as this is the 4th game in the series, I don't think thats how Bethesda works...

I can understand your negative take on the form it was released on, as it did not work on your system, or barely did. If the same thing happened to me I would probably never have started this thread, or would have done so in the opposite side. In any case you seem to be blaming the wrong people, as it is the publishers who do this. Sure, the developers could scale back the project and give you an updated morrowind, or they could try something new and seriously kick ass...Personally I am glad they chose the latter.
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